ConBee III, Docker, 32+ Xiaomi

deCONZ General Support
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Below in English, I don’t know the rules here yet :wink:

Hallo zusammen,

ich habe ein paar generelle Fragen zu meinem Setup und hoffe auch auf ein paar Tipps. Denn leider funktioniert nicht alles reibungslos.

Ich komme von zwei Xiaomi Gateways (aufgrund der maximal 32 Geräte pro Gateway) und bin auf einen ConBee III Stick umgestiegen. Dieser Stick hängt an meinem Unraid Server an einem USB2 Steckplatz und an einem ~2m langen USB-Verlängerungskabel. Zwei 2.4GHz WLAN APs sind 1-2 Meter entfernt, laufen aber auf Kanal 9 und 11. Auf dem Rechner läuft ein deconzcommunity/deconz Docker Container. Aktuell kommen ausschließlich Xiaomi Komponenten zum Einsatz, allerdings mehr als 32 Stück, nämlich im Moment knapp 50.

Die ersten Probleme hatte ich, weil mir zuerst nicht ganz klar war, dass auch beim ConBee Stick die Maximalzahl von 32 steht - solange kein ZigBee Repeater/Router (also diese dauerbestromten Geräte wie Steckdosen oder Lichter) zum Einsatz kommen. Es war eh schon teilweise tricky, die Xiaomi Komponenten zu pairen, und das hat es dann nicht einfacher gemacht. Zusätzlich fielen dann wieder welche raus (wurden im Webinterface grau angezeigt und hatten keine Verbindungslinien mehr in der Desktopapp via VNC).

Daher habe ich mir nun noch einen IKEA TRÅDFRI Signalverstärker bestellt. Laut Internet soll es mit diesem dann klappen, die 32er Grenze zu überwinden. Mit einer Lidl Silvercrest Zwischensteckdose ergab sich keine Änderung. Allerdings war auch zu lesen, dass es für Xiaomi Komponenten kompatible und inkompatible Router/Repeater gibt - und der Signalverstärker von Ikea ist wohl kompatibel. Dennoch dazu konkret Nachfragen:

Es war zu lesen, dass es (Xiaomi) Komponenten im ZigBee Mesh nicht zwischen den “Parents” hin und her springen. Ist das so? Falls ja, brauche ich mich auch nicht wundern, wenn ich in der Desktopapp keinen Unterschied sehe, also keine Linien, die von der Lidlsteckdose zu einer Xiaomi Komponente laufen. Und, wenn das so ist, wie kriege ich sie dazu, sich anderswo zu verbinden? Irgendwo stand auch, den Button drücken, dann springen sie. Oder ganz neu pairen und wie stelle ich dann sicher, dass sie auf dem richtigen Parent sind? :thinking:

Dann noch generell: Ich habe alle nicht genutzten Komponenten gelöscht und bin nun auf ca 40 runter. Also immer noch zu viele, aber nicht mehr so viel. Stören die sich dann gegenseitig oder sollten von den 40 dann 32 tun? Denn das passiert nämlich nicht. Mehrfach den Container neu gestartet, inzwischen sehe ich nur noch zwei Linien in der Desktopapp. Dazu alle Xiaomi Komponenten auf schwarz in der Weboberfläche. Aber es sind deutlich weniger als 32 wirklich funktional. Sprich Tür/Fenster auf und zu und es passiert nichts, das darf natürlich nicht sein. Was mache ich falsch oder ist das “normal”, da mehr als 32 und kein kompatibler Repeater/Router mit dabei?

Zum Setup der Hardware: USB2 Verlängerungskabel mit ~2m okay oder lieber länger? Weiter weg von den WLAN APs? Wie schaut es mit diesen USB-LAN-USB Adaptern? So könnte ich den Stick auch wo ganz anders platzieren als im Arbeitszimmer, wo halt der Server steht.

Mir fällt sicherlich noch mehr ein, aber ich belasse es mal dabei. :wink:

Freue mich auf Antworten, Tipps und Impressionen, danke und
viele Grüße,
Martin

Hello everyone,

I have a few general questions about my setup and I’m hoping for some tips. Unfortunately, not everything works smoothly here.

I come from an setup with two Xiaomi gateways (due to the maximum of 32 devices per gateway) and switched to a ConBee III stick. This stick is attached to a USB2 port on my Unraid server and a ~2m long USB extension cable. Two 2.4GHz Wifi APs are 1-2 meters away, but run on channels 9 and 11. A deconzcommunity/deconz Docker container is running on the computer. Currently only Xiaomi components are used, but more than 32, almost 50 at the moment.

I had the first problems because it wasn’t entirely clear to me that the ConBee stick also has a maximum number of 32 - as long as no ZigBee repeater/router (i.e. these permanently powered devices such as power sockets or lights) is used. And it is sometimes tricky to pair the Xiaomi components anyway, so that didn’t make it any easier. In addition, some were dropped again (showed up in gray color in the web interface and no longer had connecting lines in the desktop app via VNC).

That’s why I ordered an IKEA TRÅDFRI signal amplifier. According to the Internet, this should make it possible to overcome the 32 limit. There was no change with a Lidl Silvercrest adapter socket. However, I also read that there are compatible and incompatible routers/repeaters for Xiaomi components - and the signal amplifier from Ikea is most likely compatible. However, specific questions:

I read that (Xiaomi) components do not jump back and forth between the parents in the ZigBee mesh. Is that so? If so, I shouldn’t be surprised if I don’t see any difference in the desktop app, i.e. no lines running from the Lidl socket to a Xiaomi component. And, if so, how do I get them to connect elsewhere? I also read that pressing the button makes them jump. Or pair from scratch and then how do I make sure they are on the right parent? :thinking:

Then in general: I deleted all unused components and am now down to about 40. So still too many, but not as much as before. Do they then interfere with each other or should 32 of the 40 work? Because that doesn’t happen. I restarted the container several times and now I only see two lines in the desktop app. But all Xiaomi components are black in the web interface. But significantly fewer than 32 that are really functional. I open and close the door/window and nothing happens, of course that shouldn’t be the case. What am I doing wrong or is this “normal” since there are more than 32 and no compatible repeater/router included?

About setting up the hardware: An USB2 extension cable with ~2m is okay or would you prefer longer? Placing it further away from the Wifi APs? What about these USB-LAN-USB adapters? With these adapters I could also place the stick somewhere completely different than in the room, where the server is.

I’m sure I can think of more, but I’ll leave it at that. :wink:

I look forward to answers, tips and impressions, thank you and
best regards,
Martin

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Hello

I read that (Xiaomi) components do not jump back and forth between the parents in the ZigBee mesh

Yes, and if the parent disconnect, the device leave the network (not immediate ofc, you can restart the gateway)

And, if so, how do I get them to connect elsewhere? I also read that pressing the button makes them jump

Yes, probably, never tested on my side, but I have see this comment lot of time

Or pair from scratch and then how do I make sure they are on the right parent? :thinking:

Yes, the correct method is first set routers, then sensors on definitive place, it’s technicaly possible to force a selected router to be in permit mode and only him, but not realy usefull, and idk if it’s possible using deconz. It need to be automatic.

I restarted the container several times

Can need 1 hour before the first report, so the device can stay grayed long time.

But significantly fewer than 32 that are really functional. I open and close the door/window and nothing happens, of course that shouldn’t be the case

Ha yes, sorry the device have probably DC. But it’s with the IKEA router ?

Do they then interfere with each other or should 32 of the 40 work?

Lol, good question, for information a user exceeded the limit of 32 devices for years (and it worked), but his network broke (I don’t remember the reason) and he was not able to to do it again and was forced to put routers.

Just a comment, a zigbee network is a meshed network, it’s not an “option”, if you don’t have a meshed network, perhaps it’s better to use another protocol ?

1 Like
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Thank you for your answer.

There is no option in deCONZ - or I did not see it. It looks the same with or without the Lidl power plug, which is a router.

And if it is automatic, then the components should roam - or switched to a different router using the button. Well, maybe the Lidl power plug is not compatible with the Xiaomi components. I will see if there is a difference with the Ikea device.

Still on the way, can’t say, yet.

Well, I just wanted to replace the two Xiaomi gateways and keep my 50 components, mostly sensors. If I need another device like the Ikea signal amplifier, that’s fine. But replacing all Xiaomi devices with other devices, ZigBee or a different architecture/protocol, would cost a lot of money. And time.

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Hallo zusammen,

kann mir wirklich niemand zu meinen grundsätzlichen Fragen aus dem ersten Beitrag dieses Themas weiterhelfen? Ich finde es ja schon erstaunlich, dass diese Sachen sich nur schwer und (für mich) nicht mit Sicherheit ermitteln lassen. Daher dachte ich, ich frage bei der “Quelle” nach, da muss das doch jeder wissen. :wink: Mir geht’s neben den grundsätzlichen Fragen um Best-Practice eines aus meiner Sicht eigentlich einfachen Netzaufbaus.

Danke und Grüße,
Martin

Hello everyone,

can really nobody help me with my basic questions from the first post in this topic? I find it astonishing that these things are difficult to determine with certainty (for me). That’s why I thought I’d ask the “source”, as everyone must know :wink: Apart from the basic questions, I’m interested in best practice for what is actually a simple network structure in my eyes.

Thanks and best regards,
Martin

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On my side I have a router not compatible with Xiaomi, the inclusion is fine, and it use the router, but it disconnect after 24h.
If it’s automatic, the coordinator need to choose itself the best routers to use. And the problem with Xiami don’t come from router but the Xiaomi sensor, less problem on other brands.

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Please post in English, as we are an English community :slight_smile:

Yes.

You can’t. They pick routes themselves.

What you need is more routers. Yes, it should be able to handle 32 end nodes but in real life scenario’s I’ve seen 20~ being the limit depending on the devices.

I recommend getting at least a 5 to 1 ratio(5 end nodes per router). However, 3-1 is better. That’s how you build a healthy mesh :slight_smile:

If you get some lights you should be good.

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Okay I will. :+1:

I don’t understand that because your two statements contradict each other.

If the devices don’t jump (pick) their best route, how do they pick route? :wink:

Or do you mean that they only pick during pairing and that’s it? So if one of the routers is offline, the devices connected to that router are also offline. And that for good? Wow…

Okay, 32 to 3 is a big difference. So why is there a 32 limit at all? Btw, with the two Xiaomi gateways the 32 limit was never a problem, over years. Until the one gateway which was completely full with 32 devices suddenly died.

Anyway, I bought one Ikea signal amplifier and two Ikea power plugs, for now. I hope that is enough until I did check and think about the rest of my home network. Even if the ratio is 50 to 4 then…

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This indeed.

This only goes for Xiaomi sensors though.

Because it’s probably made for it and not using the zigbee standard. Could be software, could be luck. Zigbee is meant as a mesh, not a single point network.

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The ratio is not something to lead you. It needs to be balanced across your site as wel.

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Thank you again for your reply.

Okay. Then I will try to press the button for some of the sensors - if needed, which should put them on a different router. We’ll see.

I did not see it that way, until now. Maybe Xiaomi does some good things after all. My configuration here was rockstable - until the gateway died. But then I wanted to improve the configuration here. Also I never liked it that I need to give internet to the gateways when first pairing the devices. Also, when you do not block internet it is interesting and also devastating how much traffic a gateway can create…

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